2025-12-11 05:32:PM <br/> Tags: #Donor #AmericanJewry #Event #Lobby ![[image-195.png]] *Former AIPAC president David Steiner, 2008. [Source](https://theworld.org/stories/2017/05/13/aipacs-top-5-controversial-moments)* # David Steiner Leaked AIPAC Phone Call (1992) - This page is an extension of the [[AIPAC]] page. - This section was long enough that it works better to have its own page. #### David Steiner Leaked 1992 Donor Phone Call - In 1992, AIPAC president David Steiner was forced to resign after his phone call with a Jewish donor named Haim Katz was secretly recorded and leaked. - [This is the source](https://www.wrmea.org/1992-december/january-1993/the-complete-unexpurgated-aipac-tape.html) for the full transcript. - *I have broken down key aspects of the conversation below. It's rare to get a look behind the donor-lobbyist relations curtain. Such an instance is highly useful to understand the inner workings of donor money. The content and the casualness of the conversation is truly unbelievable.* - Key parts of the conversation between AIPAC president David Steiner and Haim Katz, a New York Jewish businessman and prospective AIPAC donor: - After some general greetings Katz says: Okay, I'll just ask you very very quickly. You know, like, in New York, you know, this is your own personal opinion, like in New York we have Abrams against D'Amato. *In 1992 Republican Al D'Amato ran against Jewish Democrat Robert Abrams for the U.S. Senate seat from New York. Useful context: Abrams is Jewish, D'Amato is not Jewish, but is extremely pro-Israel.* - Steiner: Well, let me tell you what my personal position is. Okay? - Katz: Yeah. - Steiner: From a Jewish point of view, I believe in political loyalty. - Katz: Right. - Steiner: And if someone has been good for Israel, no matter who, if my brother would run against them, I would support them because they'd been good to Israel because that's an important message to people. - Katz: Now D'Amato, has he been good for Israel? - Steiner: You couldn't have a better... listen I think Abrams would be good too, but that's not the message. - Katz: Yeah. - Steiner: Ah... - Katz: So the message, so the message is that ah...I agree with you all the way, that if somebody's been good for Israel, I'll take D'Amato. But you have no complaints with D'Amato? - Steiner: I have no complaints with D'Amato. - Katz: Uh huh, so and ah, you know, let me tell you, Abrams might be, might be too liberal. I don't know if Abrams supported, let's say the ah, the [[First Gulf War|war against Iraq]]. - Steiner: Yeah, I don't know, and ah, I don't know. But all I know is if I have a guy who is there and he's doing it, then I don't want to change, you know? *Senator D'Amato had been in office since 1981.* - *At this point Senator Bob Kasten is brought up.* - Katz: Excuse my ignorance. Bob Kasten is what state? - Steiner: From Wisconsin - Katz: Okay, is he Jewish? - Steiner: He's for loan guarantees, he happens to be Republican. *Steiner is talking about loan guarantees to Israel.* - Katz: Okay, and but, he's good? He's... - Steiner: You couldn't have better - *The conversation then moves to Jewish Senate candidate Barbara Boxer.* - Katz: Get ready for this. I read in the papers this morning, I think it was the (NY) _Post,_ Barbara Boxer, in California... - Steiner: Yeah - Katz: Do you know who she is? - Steiner: I know who... - Katz: She's originally from, ah... New York I think... - Steiner: A friend of yours? - Katz: No, no, no. She's not a friend of mine, but she, ah, I think she's in trouble. - Steiner: Yeah, that's ah, in that race we're okay either way, 'cause Bruce Herschensohn, who she's running against, is Jewish, and he's very strong on our issues. - Katz: Okay, but Herschensohn... - Steiner: Herschensohn's a very conservative Republican. - Katz: You know, he's come out of nowhere. He was like 30 points behind... - Steiner: Right - Katz: He's come out of nowhere with it. - Steiner: Because the truth of the matter is, she didn't always vote for foreign aid. We had a big meeting, I had a program in L.A. I had all four senatorial candidates there, and he ripped her apart. She has always voted against foreign and. *Here Steiner is questioning whether Boxer is pro-Israel enough. Steiner reassured Katz that Boxer's opponent is Jewish, so even if Boxer were to lose "we're ok either way."* - Katz: What about the one, in ah, the one in... um, what's his name? I read it in the paper, it's just a shocker, politics is a crazy game. The black woman in Chicago... - Steiner: Carol Moseley Braun? - Katz: She was going to win by 50 points... - Steiner: Oh it's down, she took the money, it's a big problem. - Katz: It's a big problem with her... - Steiner: And we have a problem with another good friend. You know Daniel Inouye, from Hawaii he's one of our best friends. It was Kasten-Inouye on the loan guarantees, Kasten-Inouye and Leahy... - Katz: I heard, I saw it on, I know Inouye's in trouble because of, he sexually harassed his hairdresser... - Steiner: We commissioned a poll and got some people, and I've got to raise $27,000 to pay for the poll... so I have, so what I'm trying to do is make a priority list, because I don't know how far you want to go... how old are your kids by the way?... You had three children that could write checks, do they have their own checking accounts? *Here Steiner directs Katz to fund AIPAC candidates under his children's names. * - Katz: Yes. - Steiner: Oh, so that's not going to be... - Katz: How old do they have to be? - Steiner: They can't be one year old. - Katz: I mean, could they be 18, 17? - Steiner: Sure, no problem, so they could make, nobody's going to bother you, but if you had infants, a four-year-old, let's say, it's not a contest. - Katz: Let me tell you, I was planning, I was planning to, to... Inouye, by the way, is in real trouble? He's been there forever... - Steiner: Yeah! Well, we might lose him. There's been such a sea change, such trouble this year, I can't believe all our friends that are in trouble. Because there's an anti-incumbency mood, and foreign aid has not been popular. You know what I got for, I met with [U.S. Secretary of State] Jim Baker and I cut a deal with him. I got, besides the $3 billion, you know they're looking for the Jewish votes, and I'll tell him whatever he wants to hear... #RedPill *This is one of the bombshells of the conversation. Steiner essentially describes how he has a backdoor deal with the Bush 41 administration to secure Jewish votes in return for pro-Israel policy. Steiner remarks that he "got the $3 billion." This is a reference to the annual foreign aid given to Israel. Were it not for this phone call being leaked, we would not know about this. Certainly we wouldn't here the Jewish network explain it in such clear terms.* - Katz: Right - Steiner: Besides the $10 billion in loan guarantees which was a fabulous thing, $3 billion in foreign, in military aid, and I got almost a billion dollars in other goodies that people don't even know about. - Katz: Such as? - Steiner: $700 million in military draw-down, from equipment that the United States Army's going to give to Israel; $200 million the U.S. government is going to preposition materials in Israel, which Israel can draw upon; put them in the global warning protection system; so when if there's a missile fired, they'll get the same advanced notification that the U.S., is notified, joint military exercises-I've got a whole shopping list of things. - Katz: So this is from Baker? *Referencing Secretary of State James "Jim" Baker.* - Steiner: From Baker and from the Pentagon. - Katz: So, not so, not... - Steiner: Why did he do it, you know, why did he do it? Last year I was a bum. This year I said look Jim, we're going to fight on the F-l5s. Israel doesn't want to fight, I said, but some people on it are going to come up on the floor of the Senate and the House and they're going to fight. If you'll do this, I think I can hold them back. But you've got to do it right away. They didn't want to fight. I said, "You don't want a fight before the election. It's going to hurt Bush. We don't want a fight before the election. We don't want to fight at all. Why can't we work something out?" So we cut a deal. You can't repeat this. *Steiner explains what can be considered political extortion. Steiner pressured Baker into a "deal" or else the Israel lobby would come down hard on Bush during the election year.* - Katz: You're right. But you met with Baker... - Steiner: Personally - Katz: Personally. Because you know, he's the one who cursed, who cursed the Jews. - Steiner: Of course, do you think I'm ever going to forgive him for that? #RedPill *This is the maximum redpill. The Jewish lobby employed gangster-like tactics to force the Secretary of State to concede. You would assume the Jewish "victors" would be happy with Baker; he bent the knee and did their bidding. The reality is the opposite. Steiner and Katz both had a personal vendetta against Baker for his supposed antisemitism. Steiner admits to Katz that he obviously remembers and will never forgive Baker for his crimes. Did Baker gain anything for giving in? Of course not. The ability of powerful Jews to exert their influence relies on the acceptance of their terms. A prerequisite to breaking the matrix is disregarding the terms of engagement.* - Katz: Unbelievable. I said... - Steiner: Do you think I could ever forgive Bush for what he did September 12th a year ago? What he said about the Jews for lobbying in Washington? - Katz: Do you think that Baker has a legitimate concern for the Jews? From what I hear, do you think he's anti-Semitic? - Steiner: I wouldn't go so far as to say that. He's a pragmatic businessman, he's a very tough lawyer. He does whatever it takes. - Katz: And that's why... -  Steiner: If we didn't have an election this year, you would get [unintelligible] from him. - *They then talk about Ross Perot for a moment before moving on to a discussion of the 1992 presidential election, President Bush, and candidate Bill Clinton.* - Katz: David, let me just ask you about Clinton. Honestly, what do you feel about Clinton? - Steiner: Well, I've known Bill Clinton for seven eight years. I think he's got to be a lot better than George Bush... we have a lot of people in there. But he doesn't need money, he really doesn't need money. I'm a trustee of the Democratic National Committee. We collected $63 million for him so far. - Katz: Who's collected $63 million? - Steiner: The Democratic National Committee and the Clinton campaign have raised $63 million. - Katz: So they've already raised $63 million, so they don't need money. - Steiner: No, we need money, like we got a guy, Byron Dorgan, in North Dakota, who's going to be very good for us and we need money to make sure that he gets in. We've got people like that, because [unintelligible], whatever you give them would be a tickle on the elephant's behind. But when you give $5,000 or $10,000 to Bob Kasten, that's very meaningful. - Katz: Let me ask you, I understand what you're saying. Clinton, when Clinton first started running a year ago, did he need money at that time? - Steiner: Yes he did. - Katz: I mean, did you help him out, 'cause that's the time... - Steiner: I personally am not allowed, as president of AIPAC, to get involved in the presidential campaign, because I have to deal with whoever wins. You know, I've got to go see Bush if he's there, but I helped him, we raised over a million dollars for him in New Jersey. - Katz: For Clinton? - Steiner: For Clinton. - Katz: And this was when, in the beginning? - Steiner: In the beginning, yes. After he won, before the convention. *The 1992 Democratic National Convention (DNC) was held in mid July.* - Katz: This is before the convention? - Steiner: Oh sure. - Katz: Okay, let me ask you, you know, T - Steiner: We've also raised for other guys who are running too, because they're friends. Harkin, the senator, you know you have to be with everybody. *Senator Tom Harkin is one of the largest recipients of pro-Israel PAC money of all time.* - Katz: Let me ask you, [talks about getting cheated in business by Gentiles]. Let me ask you, Clinton, if he becomes, I mean what will he do for Israel, better than Bush, if he becomes, I know Bush gave you a hard time, this and that... - Steiner: I'II tell you, I have friends on the Clinton campaign, close associates. Gore is very committed to us. - Katz: Right. Clinton if he, have you spoken to him? - Steiner: I've known Bill for seven, eight years from the National Governors Association. I know him on a personal basis. I have friends. One of my friends is Hillary Clinton's scheduler, one of my officer's daughters works there. We gave two employees from AIPAC leave of absences to work on the campaign. I mean, we have a dozen people in that campaign, in the headquarters. - Katz: You mean in Little Rock? - Steiner: In Little Rock, and they're all going to get big jobs. We have friends. I also work with a think tank, the [[Washington Institute for Near East Policy (WINEP)|Washington Institute]]. I have Michael Mandelbaum and [[Martin Indyk]] being foreign policy advisers. Steve Speigel—we've got friends—this is my business. - Katz: I understand, David. - Steiner: It's very complicated and the more you get into it, you'll love it. You sound like a smart guy. - Katz: I'm a smart guy, but I have a, maybe because I'm more orthodox than you are, I've had bad experiences with Gentiles. Let me ask you, you know what _"tachlis"_ means? *Tachlis is Yiddish word for the Judaic principle usually meaning the "ultimate purpose." Tachlis is somewhat similar to "getting down to brass tacks."* - Steiner: Yeah, Sure. - Katz: From a practical point of view, if Clinton wins the presidency, and I'm sure he will, I hope so at least, what will be the benefits to Israel better than Bush? From a very practical point... I mean, you just told me that Bush gave you everything you wanted... - Steiner: Only, not everything, at the end, when we didn't want the F-15s, that's a terrible thing. - Katz: Selling the F-15s? If Clinton is elected... - Steiner: Let me tell you the problem with the $10 billion in loan guarantees, right? We only have the first year. We have authorization from Congress, but it's at the discretion of the president every year thereafter, so if Bush is there, he could say, you know, use it as a club, you know. 'If you don't give up Syria, I won't give you the money. If you don't give up the Golan Heights.' It's at the discretion of the president. And that's why we need a friendly president and we have Bill Clinton's ear. I talked to Bill Clinton. *This is a crucial insight into the way AIPAC sees political leverage at the presidential level.* - Katz: And Bill Clinton has made a commitment that if he's elected...? - Steiner: He's going to be very good for us. - Katz: And he'll go ahead with the loan guarantees? - Steiner: We didn't talk about that specifically, listen, I didn't ask him that, but I have full confidence that we're going to have a much better situation. He's got Jewish friends. A girl who worked for me at AIPAC stood up for them at their wedding. Hillary lived with her. I mean we have those relationships. We have never had that with Bush. Susan Thomases, who's in there, worked with me on the Bradley campaign. We worked together for 13 years. She's In there with the family. They stay with her when they come to New York. One of my officers, Monte Friedkin, is one of the biggest fund-raisers for them. I mean, I have people like that all over the country. *This excerpt from Steiner paints the perfect picture of the way Jews are organized. They work together using their personal networks of likeminded Jewish associates to exert influence in all the right places. The Jewish network is connected through a shared Jewish identity. This Jewish identity is often not even religious, many are secular Jews. This Jewish network works together to forward their perceived collective interest, with Israel as the common center of gravity.* - Katz: So, I mean from a practical point of view... - Steiner: He's going to be with us. - Katz: I don't say, this business, you say, Bush only went ahead with the loan guarantees for one year. - Steiner: We only have. It's mandatory they give us the $2 billion for one year. After that it's subject to the discretion of the president. *Steiner refers to Israel as "us."* - Katz: You mean the other $8 billion? - Steiner: That's correct. On an annualized basis. - Katz: Also, I heard that... - Steiner: They don't have to give it to us. - Katz: But if Clinton is elected... - Steiner: Feel reasonably certain we're gonna get It. - Katz: He's made that commitment? - Steiner: Well, he said he's going to help us. He's got something in his heart for the Jews, he has Jewish friends. Bush has no Jewish friends. *Just notice how important all of this is to them. They are 100% single issue voters/backers. Everything is about Israel and their fellow Jews. This is a reality many are unaware of. So much power is held by these exact people who genuinely only care about Israel and nothing else. In a sovereign nation, this is an unacceptable condition.* - Katz: Right. - Steiner: Reagan had something... _meshuga,_ but at least he had a commitment. He knew Jews from the film industry, he was one of the best guys for us. He had an emotional thing for the Jews. Bush doesn't have it. That's what it is really, if you have a feeling for our people, for what we believe in. Bush is, there's a man with no principles. Absolutely no principles. *Meshuga is a Yiddish work for insane or very foolish.* - Katz: I heard something about, but I never really understood it, with the scoring. One of my friends told me there's a difference in the scoring, but I don't understand... - Steiner: Scoring is like points that you pay. - Katz: So let's say, if Bush is elected on the loans... - Steiner: No, we've got the scoring arranged, it's four and a half percent. It's all done. - Katz: That's all done, even with Bush? - Steiner: Even with Bush. I've got that worked out. - Katz: So that's all done. - Steiner: It's in the bill. It's all passed. He signed the bill. It's a matter of law. - Katz: So it's already four and a half percent? - Steiner: We could've had it less, but then we couldn't... - Katz: And Clinton, if he was president, he would give...? - Steiner: He could not change it, you cannot change it. - Katz: No, but I'm saying, if he was president now, before the bill was signed, he would've given you the four and a half percent... - Steiner: I would've gotten less. - Katz: I'm sorry? - Steiner: I would've gotten it cheaper. - Katz: How much? Even two percent? - Steiner: Yeah, we thought we were going to get two percent. But [[Yitzhak Rabin|Rabin]] gave it away. - Katz: You mean Rabin didn't bargain as good as he could have? - Steiner: That's right. - Katz: Unbelievable. So, if Clinton is elected, that will be the best... - Steiner: I think that will be the best we could do. - *Katz and Steiner then bond over the holocaust, and their common family history in WWII. This conversation leads into a discussion of political power.* - Katz: Right. Let me tell you that, you know what my father always says? My father was a rich man in Poland, and he says, he says, "Economic power is very good. You have to have money, but if you just have economic power and you don't have political power..." - Steiner: You've got nothing. - Katz: You've got nothing. - Steiner: If we had AIPAC in the '30s and '40s, we would have saved millions of Jews. We would have the political power. But Jews were afraid to open their mouths. They didn't know how. - Katz: AIPAC started after WWII? - Steiner: Oh, sure. - Katz: And if you would have had AIPAC in the - Steiner: I feel we would've saved a lot of Jews. - Katz: And Franklin Roosevelt, he could've done a lot better? - Steiner: Sure, he could. The Jews never opened their mouths. They were afraid. We're not afraid. They can curse me out, I don't care if they hate me, just as long as I get what we need for our people. *This is not true. The Jewish lobby aggressively lobbied the Roosevelt administration during the 1930s and 40s against Germany. It is true that AIPAC didn't exist, but the ZOA, AJC, ADL, JDC, UIA, AZEC, WJC, AJCongress, and B'nai B'rith did. All are covered in this project.* - Katz: So if you had a little lamp, a wishing lamp and you could wish for either Bush, Clinton or Perot... - Steiner: Clinton. - Katz: Clinton all the way? And in terms of Israel having political power, between the three candidates, the one who will give us the most political power? *Notice how both Katz and Steiner repeatedly associate themselves with Israel as "us."* - Steiner: Clinton is the best guy for us. - Katz: He's the best one. - Steiner: I hope you're serious about what you told me. - Katz: I am, I'll tell you this [tells a long anecdote about David Souter promising to oppose abortion as a nominee and then reversing himself on the Supreme Court]. So I wish we had a Jewish candidate for president. - Steiner: I don't think the country's ready. - Katz: If the country was ready, is there any Jewish candidate...? - Steiner: I wouldn't venture to say anything. - Katz: You know who? I don't know him, I've never met him, [[Joe Lieberman]]. - Steiner: Oh, I'm very friendly with Joe. I'm having dinner with him Monday night. - Katz: Let me tell you, I think Joe Lieberman would have, uh, would have, if he wasn't Jewish, that's the only problem he has. He's highly respected. - Steiner: I'd like to see him on the Supreme Court. - Katz: If Clinton is elected, has he told you who he's going to put on the Supreme Court? - Steiner: We're talking now. We don't have no commitments yet. We're just negotiating. We're more interested right now, in the secretary of state and the secretary of National Security Agency. That's more important to us. *Clinton put two Justices on the Supreme Court. Ruth Bader Ginsburg in 1993, and Stephen Breyer in 1994. Both were Jewish.* - Katz: If Clinton is elected, who do you think will be secretary of state? - Steiner: We don't know yet, we're negotiating. - Katz: Who are you hoping for? - Steiner: I've got a list. But I really can't go through it. I'm not allowed to talk about it. - Katz: But you figure, God willing, if Clinton's elected... - Steiner: We'll have access. - Katz: You'll have access and you'll have a good input into who's secretary of state. - Steiner: I do believe so. - Katz: And the other position is... - Steiner: National security adviser. - Katz: Those are the two critical positions. - Steiner: Right. - Katz: Gotcha. Well, David, thanks for talking with me. - Steiner: And we're going to get together next week. I hope you'll have your checkbook ready. - Katz: Will do. #### References - _The Complete Unexpurgated AIPAC Tape._ Washington Report on Middle East Affairs, December 1992/January 1993, posted November 24. 2009. [https://www.wrmea.org/1992-december/january-1993/the-complete-unexpurgated-aipac-tape.html](https://www.wrmea.org/1992-december/january-1993/the-complete-unexpurgated-aipac-tape.html). - Jonathan Steele. “James Baker: The Man Who Said No to Israel.” _Middle East Eye_, July 13, 2021. [https://www.middleeasteye.net/opinion/us-israel-james-baker-man-ran-washington-book](https://www.middleeasteye.net/opinion/us-israel-james-baker-man-ran-washington-book?). - “Tachlis.” _Jewish English Lexicon_. [https://jel.jewish-languages.org/words/556](https://jel.jewish-languages.org/words/556).